Dating after lockdown #38 midnight messages from the ghost of boyfriends past

[IGiveUp22]

I got told yesterday to “pick better men” even though I’m not dating I was just telling someone about that guy I was seeing earlier this year and he’s now having a baby (see prev post for info if you want that)

And I know the person was being funny etc but that just really pisses me off because it infers it’s my fault. It’s my fault I haven’t found someone, it’s my fault that when I’ve dated it’s not worked out and I’ve worked very hard to get out of that mindset.
These are also the comments that make me not want to start dating again because if I “pick the wrong men” I’m doomed anyway

I do definitely think there are good men out there, even on the apps, and I didn’t mean to suggest otherwise when I mentioned people settle. I’d love to meet someone organically but I don’t go anywhere

 

[Lalla]

I think there's a real difference in societal attitudes to single men and women.

With men who are single (particularly past 40) there's always comments about how they are either married to their work, or just haven't met the right person for them, or never got over a past relationship heartbreak. It's always 'such a shame' they are single, and never their fault.

Whereas for us women, it's always our fault.
Bad relationships - that's down to us, we should have predicted that the seemingly nice and pleasant man we met would in 3 months, or 6 months, or 3 years turn into a narcissist/ abuser etc. We should pick better men
If we can't get dates at all - we're too picky. If we get bad dates - we're not picky enough.
We get few messages or the wrong kind of messages - it's our profile, which isn't interesting, or the photos are unflattering or 'too sexy' (men never get told this even though half of them put 'will fill this out later' on their profiles and have photos of themselves shirtless, or on the beach or whatever). Ditto hobbies - men never have them, but as women we're boring (and by inference won't attract a man) if we don't.
And then there's the whole thing of needing to lose weight, or dress differently. I read someone once advise getting veneers because men will be put off if your teeth are not white and straight! Have they seen some of the men out there? They make Michael Gove look handsome!

Plus not making enough effort/ putting yourself out there - this is one I got recently. Whilst I did explain that I saw no one on my brief foray onto the apps who was in any way suitable (and I don't have the will to do another 4 years on there to meet someone, which is how long it took me last time), I'm told I didn't do it for long enough/ try hard enough - my fault again. Funny no one blames my Ex, who I loved and thought I would be with for the rest of my life, for being an unfaithful lying shitbag. If he wasn't, we'd still be together and I wouldn't be in this position.

I agree there are still some decent men out there, somewhere. But are there decent men who would be attracted to/ interested in me, and vice versa? That I'm not convinced of at all.

 

[Clickbait]

Plus not making enough effort/ putting yourself out there - this is one I got recently. Whilst I did explain that I saw no one on my brief foray onto the apps who was in any way suitable (and I don't have the will to do another 4 years on there to meet someone, which is how long it took me last time), I'm told I didn't do it for long enough/ try hard enough - my fault again.

I agree there are still some decent men out there, somewhere. But are there decent men who would be attracted to/ interested in me, and vice versa? That I'm not convinced of at all.

I don’t disagree with you that there is an unfair difference in how men and women are treated with regards dating but of course - although only in a conversation that you have started about not being able to meet someone (not off their own bat offering their opinion) - people can say that if you’re not putting yourself in a position to meet someone, it’s unlikely that you will. I know that people also suggest that you’ll find someone when you least expect it - there is a lot of mystifyingly stupid advice around dating - but in reality how many people nowadays meet a life partner doing their daily commute or a shop at the supermarket? If you lead an insular life, following a similar routine you have less exposure to new situations, places and people.

If you don’t want to go back on the apps that is absolutely fine, and there are clearly other organised events that could be explored which may also leave you cold. But clearly doing nothing won’t change your present situation. I’m not sure stating that is inferring blame, it’s common sense. If you’re going to throw yourself back into the app dating then you have to be in the right mindset but clearly need to give it more than a day to see if someone pops up.

 

[Lalla]

I think the advice given to women is often unsolicited, certainly in my case I was just congratulating a friend who had met someone, in response to which she told me that I would 'easily' meet someone too if I just went on the apps etc. Because for her it was that simple, she was matching with decent men and getting (good) dates straight off the bat - but that certainly wasn't my past experience nor my recent albeit brief foray.

I spent 4 years really putting in effort, completely believing the mantra that it was a numbers game and someone would eventually turn up. Every night I would be on dating sites (no apps back then) exchanging messages, I went on many dates (almost all of which were unmemorable at best, awful at worst) and honestly I look back now and it just feels like a massive waste of some of the best years of my life - none of it was ever fun or even interesting, just a relentless slog. Of course I did eventually meet someone but despite being completely different and vastly better than anyone else I encountered in those 4 years (or indeed throughout my adult life - it was the one time where I genuinely thought I had met a life partner), that didn't work out.

 

[Clickbait]

I think the advice given to women is often unsolicited, certainly in my case I was just congratulating a friend who had met someone, in response to which she told me that I would 'easily' meet someone too if I just went on the apps etc. Because for her it was that simple, she was matching with decent men and getting (good) dates straight off the bat - but that certainly wasn't my past experience nor my recent albeit brief foray.

I spent 4 years really putting in effort, completely believing the mantra that it was a numbers game and someone would eventually turn up. Every night I would be on dating sites (no apps back then) exchanging messages, I went on many dates (almost all of which were unmemorable at best, awful at worst) and honestly I look back now and it just feels like a massive waste of some of the best years of my life - none of it was ever fun or even interesting, just a relentless slog. Of course I did eventually meet someone but despite being completely different and vastly better than anyone else I encountered in those 4 years (or indeed throughout my adult life - it was the one time where I genuinely thought I had met a life partner), that didn't work out.

To use the slogan from the betting adverts - when the fun stops, stop. I know from my own experience that persevering when your heart isn’t in it is pointless. You feel there are these sunk costs and the only way to retrieve something is to date more. You even think that you don’t know your own mind or have clearly been going for a type which hasn’t worked so you start dating men that you think are unsuitable just to try and challenge the approach you have previously taken - that never works out well!

I also understand the weird phenomena that some people live a blessed dating life. A good friend met her now ex-husband when she was 18 at Uni. She really hadn’t dated at all before that. They got married in her mid-twenties, they had kids soon after. He cheated and they split. She was single for a while, went on 2 dates, is still with the guy she had the second date with. Her online/app dating experience lasted 3 weeks!

Another friend also met her bf at uni. He was awful but she was with him for years. When she finally saw the light and moved on she had about 4 dates before meeting the man she is now married to. She was engaged in the process for under 2 months.

They both loved listening to my horror stories, but clearly had a wildly different experience to my 300+ first dates. Is it all down to luck? It certainly wasn’t a numbers game for them. Were they just more in tune with picking the right person? It really is baffling, and hugely frustrating if you’re the friend putting in the effort and not getting the same results.

 

[MollyMalone]

They both loved listening to my horror stories, but clearly had a wildly different experience
[/QUOTE]

This right here drives me crazy. I am SICK of being considered the source of entertainment for friends, family and even work colleagues with my "dating woes" this is my actual life you heartless fucks and if you must know, it's soul destroying to be disappointed time and time again. And anyway Claire, your husband is a wanker who reshares Jordan Peterson shite on his Facebook so I don't know what your so smug about !!

 

[EddyDarling]

I'm back on tinder and having a great time tbf. I don't tend to take much very seriously so it's all pretty breezy. Might even have some dates lined up for the new year

I'm under the assumption that Mr Tinder is not planning on seeing me for Christmas as I've asked and fully expect no reply (but he has mentioned he will be back in Qatar by his birthday) , I feel a bit guilty being on a dating app but also he also ignores me for days so I don't feel like I'm in a relationship anymore, so I'm not sure I should feel guilty Why does he disappear, why won't he engage in a long enough conversation to get dumped fgs

 

[Rayne]

I'm back on tinder and having a great time tbf. I don't tend to take much very seriously so it's all pretty breezy. Might even have some dates lined up for the new year

I'm under the assumption that Mr Tinder is not planning on seeing me for Christmas as I've asked and fully expect no reply (but he has mentioned he will be back in Qatar by his birthday) , I feel a bit guilty being on a dating app but also he also ignores me for days so I don't feel like I'm in a relationship anymore, so I'm not sure I should feel guilty Why does he disappear, why won't he engage in a long enough conversation to get dumped fgs

Why does he need dumping if he disappears on you for days? Sounds like he’s dumped himself. Good you’re moving on though from him as he’s treated you like crap this year

 

[MollyMalone]

I'm back on tinder and having a great time tbf. I don't tend to take much very seriously so it's all pretty breezy. Might even have some dates lined up for the new year

I'm under the assumption that Mr Tinder is not planning on seeing me for Christmas as I've asked and fully expect no reply (but he has mentioned he will be back in Qatar by his birthday) , I feel a bit guilty being on a dating app but also he also ignores me for days so I don't feel like I'm in a relationship anymore, so I'm not sure I should feel guilty Why does he disappear, why won't he engage in a long enough conversation to get dumped fgs

I'm so glad to hear you are having fun on tinder again! You deserve it Mr. Tinder's behaviour has been tit and immature. I don't think you have anything to feel guilty about but I totally get why you feel like that.

duck it, go ahead and have those dates and enjoy yourself! You don't owe him anything and it's not your fault he won't have a long enough convo to allow you to dump his sorry ass

 

[Clickbait]

They both loved listening to my horror stories, but clearly had a wildly different experience

This right here drives me crazy. I am SICK of being considered the source of entertainment for friends, family and even work colleagues with my "dating woes" this is my actual life you heartless fucks and if you must know, it's soul destroying to be disappointed time and time again. And anyway Claire, your husband is a wanker who reshares Jordan Peterson shite on his Facebook so I don't know what your so smug about !!
[/QUOTE]
Oh yeah, it can be heartless but most of the time it’s just not really considering that whilst entertaining for them, you’re actually living through it. The truth is that many of these people have never been through the process and so it holds some kind of allure - I remember when Tinder first came out and they all wanted the opportunity to swipe on my phone like it was some sort of computer game. I woke up the following morning with some heinous matches and dire messages - either saccharine sweet or hugely sexual and revolting.

 

[Blueblue123]

I think it is a mixture of luck and skill, tbh

Luck: the numbers game means some people will meet someone they are better matched with quicker and some slower entirely due to chance

BUT (without victim blaming) I think there is probably a bit of skill and strategy: a profile which attracts people who are looking for genuine interaction, being very clear in your priorities, cutting lose mediocre interactions quick, pausing dating when feeling burnt out (pushing through doesn't work - I think that might be why people are often successful early), being on the right app for your needs, being on more than one app. I think photos matter quite a bit - but more in looking like you are normal/presentable/have interests/not vain/ have friends than displays of wealth/being generically sexy.

Some things might factor in which are not in your control or affect matching: time of year, if you have kids, if you are religious or not, certain jobs

Were these people dating offline too? I think increasingly people are looking offline and that helps the tone around app dating too

I agree you need to have discernment but that only stops you from having bad experiences, it won't get you to the right person.

I've been seeing someone really lovely who takes care of me. I haven't acted that differently with him than I did with the men who hurt me, except I was probably a little cautious at first. But I've been cautious before and still been hurt

I haven't cracked any code. It just so happens that when you meet someone who has good intentions and enough emotional maturity, things might just go fine.

They both loved listening to my horror stories, but clearly had a wildly different experience


This right here drives me crazy. I am SICK of being considered the source of entertainment for friends, family and even work colleagues with my "dating woes" this is my actual life you heartless fucks and if you must know, it's soul destroying to be disappointed time and time again. And anyway Claire, your husband is a wanker who reshares Jordan Peterson shite on his Facebook so I don't know what your so smug about !!

I had a friend constantly ask me about my dating life and I could tell they just wanted the crazy gossip. It was only when I said that actually, these aren't funny little stories they're quite emotionally scarring experiences that they finally left it.

I don't get people though. I would be so concerned to hear my friend going through some of what I did, I wouldn't be like "lol go do it again".

 

[EddyDarling]

Thanks
I realised I was hanging on a bit because of who he was but he's not the man that I got into a relationship with. He is a whole different person
I wanted to properly dump him a) so I can get my stuff back and get rid of his and
B) soi can tell him exactly why he was tit instead of telling himself it was my issue not his.

I'm so glad to hear you are having fun on tinder again! You deserve it Mr. Tinder's behaviour has been tit and immature. I don't think you have anything to feel guilty about but I totally get why you feel like that.

duck it, go ahead and have those dates and enjoy yourself! You don't owe him anything and it's not your fault he won't have a long enough convo to allow you to dump his sorry ass

 

[smartalec]

I wouldn't really bother talking about early dating except if a friend was at the same stage. The 'smug marrieds' asking about dating, with the casual snide remarks ("Oh I am so glad I met someone early!") is something I opt out of completely. I just look blankly and say I am not dating when people, esp colleagues, ask. Happy to leave an awkward silence.

 

[timtams]

Thanks
I realised I was hanging on a bit because of who he was but he's not the man that I got into a relationship with. He is a whole different person
I wanted to properly dump him a) so I can get my stuff back and get rid of his and
B) soi can tell him exactly why he was tit instead of telling himself it was my issue not his.

I have honestly given up on the second part with people who have no self-reflection skills or insight into themselves, and I feel so.much better for it. Different situation of course, but I was dating someone earlier in the year who already had a couple of red flags that I ignored, then one day he got really drunk and acted like a complete idiot. He was so drunk that he probably doesn't remember a lot of his behaviour and the things he was saying to me (alternating between professing his love for me despite having not been able to even say he liked me before that, and telling me I needed to be watched because I couldn't be trusted). He sent me some crappy 'apology' messages if you could even call it that (just like "sorry for last night" and "sorry again").

I didn't want to be with him anymore so I responded "let me know if you want to talk about things". I also drafted a long message about all the things he did and how I felt, the intention was to make him realise how badly he'd behaved and that he was the problem not me. I knew he would rationalise it all as being my fault so I really wanted him to know it wasn't. But then I sent the drafted message to a friend and we talked about it, and I realised there was no point. It wasn't going to make him reflect on his behaviour, and it wouldn't make him change either. If he was going to put the break up to being my fault because I'm not trustworthy or whatever he thought about me, he would do that anyway.

He never initiated a conversation after that offer and I left it there, and 5 months on I feel really good about how I handled things. He'll be stuck in the same patterns of blaming others and deflecting from his issues, and I've been working on myself and my self-esteem, and the reasons why I get myself into relationships with these unavailable immature not emotionally intelligent idiots. I treated him with respect even though he didn't do the same, I was the bigger person, and I offered to talk about things if he wanted to know why I was ending it. Not my problem that he wasn't mature enough to do so.

 

[EddyDarling]

I have honestly given up on the second part with people who have no self-reflection skills or insight into themselves, and I feel so.much better for it. Different situation of course, but I was dating someone earlier in the year who already had a couple of red flags that I ignored, then one day he got really drunk and acted like a complete idiot. He was so drunk that he probably doesn't remember a lot of his behaviour and the things he was saying to me (alternating between professing his love for me despite having not been able to even say he liked me before that, and telling me I needed to be watched because I couldn't be trusted). He sent me some crappy 'apology' messages if you could even call it that (just like "sorry for last night" and "sorry again").

I didn't want to be with him anymore so I responded "let me know if you want to talk about things". I also drafted a long message about all the things he did and how I felt, the intention was to make him realise how badly he'd behaved and that he was the problem not me. I knew he would rationalise it all as being my fault so I really wanted him to know it wasn't. But then I sent the drafted message to a friend and we talked about it, and I realised there was no point. It wasn't going to make him reflect on his behaviour, and it wouldn't make him change either. If he was going to put the break up to being my fault because I'm not trustworthy or whatever he thought about me, he would do that anyway.

He never initiated a conversation after that offer and I left it there, and 5 months on I feel really good about how I handled things. He'll be stuck in the same patterns of blaming others and deflecting from his issues, and I've been working on myself and my self-esteem, and the reasons why I get myself into relationships with these unavailable immature not emotionally intelligent idiots. I treated him with respect even though he didn't do the same, I was the bigger person, and I offered to talk about things if he wanted to know why I was ending it. Not my problem that he wasn't mature enough to do so.

Interesting, I've always done pretty much the opposite to you, I've always left relationships and friendships quietly as I've always thought it the more dignified path, but as I get older I feel more cross with myself for not telling people that it's not me, it's them.

 

[timtams]

Interesting, I've always done pretty much the opposite to you, I've always left relationships and friendships quietly as I've always thought it the more dignified path, but as I get older I feel more cross with myself for not telling people that it's not me, it's them.

That's fair, I genuinely don't feel like there's any best way to do it or right or wrong, I think I just wanted to share my experience. I think whatever is going to make you feel best in the long run is best course of action when someone else has behaved poorly!

 

[whathastheworldcometo]

Thanks
I realised I was hanging on a bit because of who he was but he's not the man that I got into a relationship with. He is a whole different person
I wanted to properly dump him a) so I can get my stuff back and get rid of his and
B) soi can tell him exactly why he was tit instead of telling himself it was my issue not his.

If you do not see him over Christmas, how will you get your earrings back? Could you send him a pre-paid envelope (registered mail) and ask him to post them to you? You said they were important to you.

He has changed for the worse, quite disappointing.

I am sad today, I feel like I am in my hamster wheel and life is passing me by.

I cannot believe I dated 2 guys this year and both where bread crumbing me. What a waste of a year!

 

[EddyDarling]

If you do not see him over Christmas, how will you get your earrings back? Could you send him a pre-paid envelope (registered mail) and ask him to post them to you? You said they were important to you.

He has changed for the worse, quite disappointing.

I am sad today, I feel like I am in my hamster wheel and life is passing me by.

I cannot believe I dated 2 guys this year and both where bread crumbing me. What a waste of a year!

I'd have to ask them to be sent to my parents as my flat has post stolen occasionally, so my earrings wouldn't make it to me tbh. He doesn't have them with him. They're at his best mates house (he used to live with him) . I don't really want them in the post as they may not make it to their destination. We have post go missing on its way to us constantly at work. I originally said to him *don't* send it as it will get lost or nicked.

 

[whathastheworldcometo]

I'd have to ask them to be sent to my parents as my flat has post stolen occasionally, so my earrings wouldn't make it to me tbh. He doesn't have them with him. They're at his best mates house (he used to live with him) . I don't really want them in the post as they may not make it to their destination. We have post go missing on its way to us constantly at work. I originally said to him *don't* send it as it will get lost or nicked.

Hopefully you can arrange something with his best mate to get them back.

 

[D2them]

Hopefully you can arrange something with his best mate to get them back.

Yeah, bypass the ex and go straight to the mate to get them back. Then you can move on properly