Bridgerton

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pettyicequeen said:
I was honestly so confused by the racial relations in Queen Charlotte, and I feel it was awkwardly shoehorned in during the show. Maybe it's also because I am German, but the idea that a black girl would be royalty in 18th century Germany is so absurd, unless you actually just do colour/race blind casting. Germany didn't have colonies at the time, I believe (we started later and weren't very successful), so how would that family have settled in Germany and become wealthy and influential enough to be married to British royalty?!

Don't get me wrong, I'm ALL for casting POCs in historical romance, it is a fantasy after all. But, I just would have preferred them to never even address it and just do a "Brandy in Cinderella" approach. This would also mean we could see other ethnicities throughout the show's run, e.g. maybe a South East Asian or South Pacific lead at some point. Now, every time someone isn't white they need this complicated backstory to justify them being a part of the ton. It just fully breaks immersion for me.

I honestly didn't like Queen Charlotte at all. The fact that it was so short and they basically had one episode that just repeated the plot from another POV was infuriating to me. I also personally wanted something more fluffy vs. constant torture and heartbreak. My life is tit, I want to escape, not be sad. But gosh, the leads were all stunning! I loved young Charlotte, her hair alone made me gasp every time, what a beauty!
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Couldn't agree more. I switched it off after episode 2. The story isn't that compelling, the lead is unlikeable and its just kind of dull.

The race thing annoys me too, like you say, its like its been shoehorned in. I have friends of variety of Asian backgrounds and they are fed up of only one race being classified as meeting diversity.

Either have it as a diverse alternative reality situation or make it a reality of the times. This watered down almost trivialising of racial inequality at the time just doesn't sit right.
 
Mark81 said:
The race thing annoys me too, like you say, its like its been shoehorned in. I have friends of variety of Asian backgrounds and they are fed up of only one race being classified as meeting diversity.

Either have it as a diverse alternative reality situation or make it a reality of the times. This watered down almost trivialising of racial inequality at the time just doesn't sit right.
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Yes, this! They aren't committing to either possible way of presenting POC in a European, historical setting. Instead, they are kind of trying to find a "romantic" way to present racism, which is uncomfortable to watch. "Trivialising" is such a good word for it! I remember watching Belle, which is based on a historical figure, and they did so well making it a romance but based on actual history. I can't speak for POC of course, but I just wonder if it would be frustrating to want to watch a sweet romance with people who FINALLY look like you, in period costumes, to finally have some escapism and just fluff, to then again having to see a clumsy, belittling representation of your own daily struggles.

For me, it was just absurd to see a "German" member of the landed gentry be fully black. Because again, we had no colonies at the time?! Where did they come from, why would they settle in Germany?! How did they end up with a title in the first place?! Also, why did she speak posh, fluent, British English? Not even the tiniest bit of a German accent?
 
Mark81 said:
Couldn't agree more. I switched it off after episode 2. The story isn't that compelling, the lead is unlikeable and its just kind of dull.

The race thing annoys me too, like you say, its like its been shoehorned in. I have friends of variety of Asian backgrounds and they are fed up of only one race being classified as meeting diversity.

Either have it as a diverse alternative reality situation or make it a reality of the times. This watered down almost trivialising of racial inequality at the time just doesn't sit right.
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Bit in bold isn’t fair - the female leads of last season were south Asian, and there were Asian characters as part of the ‘other side of the ton’ in this one too. It just so happened that the leads in this series were black. The point made is very true but not in this particular show.

I do agree that it’s a little clumsy, but as noted, it’s fiction and fantasy. Yes, there were no black people in Germany and they’re not speaking in German accents, but it’s a plot device - Queen Charlotte came from a far away land where obviously racial dynamics were different, and her inclusion led the way for changes here. In this story. I think if perhaps they were using completely fictional people it might bother people less? I mean, the clothes are often wrong for the era, not too much is made about that?

I think if people completely remove their expectations for facts it might lead to a little more enjoyment. The writers clearly wanted to nod to the fact that by the time we join Daphne and Simon, society is very much integrated. Again, it’s a bit sloppy but I think they tried to give an explanation as light as possible.
 
Lilliepad said:
Bit in bold isn’t fair - the female leads of last season were south Asian, and there were Asian characters as part of the ‘other side of the ton’ in this one too. It just so happened that the leads in this series were black. The point made is very true but not in this particular show.

I do agree that it’s a little clumsy, but as noted, it’s fiction and fantasy. Yes, there were no black people in Germany and they’re not speaking in German accents, but it’s a plot device - Queen Charlotte came from a far away land where obviously racial dynamics were different, and her inclusion led the way for changes here. In this story. I think if perhaps they were using completely fictional people it might bother people less? I mean, the clothes are often wrong for the era, not too much is made about that?

I think if people completely remove their expectations for facts it might lead to a little more enjoyment. The writers clearly wanted to nod to the fact that by the time we join Daphne and Simon, society is very much integrated. Again, it’s a bit sloppy but I think they tried to give an explanation as light as possible.
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Yes I phrased it badly and was more referring to queen Charlotte. It's back to majority white cast (based on what iv3 watched, admittedly ive given up on it now) instead of the truly diverse cast of Bridgerton. It's just adds to the muddled narrative of both shows around race, who is and isn't accepted and the reasons why.
 
Lilliepad said:
Yes, there were no black people in Germany and they’re not speaking in German accents, but it’s a plot device - Queen Charlotte came from a far away land where obviously racial dynamics were different, and her inclusion led the way for changes here. In this story.
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But that's my point: it is NOT a "plot device" and not a "faraway land." I'd much prefer that! But, the actual historical Queen Charlotte actually was German. So, they made her German in the story to stick to the historical facts. They didn't make up her being from, whatever, Genovia, a land where black royalty exists. They want it both ways, they want the historical facts but also the made up history. They mix fact and fiction in really weird, half-hearted ways to create a semi-fictional, semi-parallel-but-also-kinda-historically-accurate universe that is confusing and, to me, constantly takes me out of the fantasy.

And, well, the other side effect is that plenty of clueless Americans now think Queen Charlotte was actually black. Seen plenty of misinformed TikTok videos about it these past weeks.

Also, I personally don't care about clothes because that's not my thing, but I've seen tons of people criticise the costumes, so that point doesn't stand. Especially the whole "women all wear tight corsets" things, which wasn't true at all for the time. And is silly to add for the supposed "fictional" story, just to give Eloise a white feminist moment when she complains about it.
 
pettyicequeen said:
But that's my point: it is NOT a "plot device" and not a "faraway land." I'd much prefer that! But, the actual historical Queen Charlotte actually was German. So, they made her German in the story to stick to the historical facts. They didn't make up her being from, whatever, Genovia, a land where black royalty exists. They want it both ways, they want the historical facts but also the made up history. They mix fact and fiction in really weird, half-hearted ways to create a semi-fictional, semi-parallel-but-also-kinda-historically-accurate universe that is confusing and, to me, constantly takes me out of the fantasy.
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But therein lies the problem. They make it clear that it’s not at all factual right at the beginning. You’re right, if they just chose different names, this wouldn’t be an issue. I spent a fair amount of time studying George III and his role in American Independence but neither Bridgerton or Hamilton for that matter bother me because it’s artistic license and both do not claim to be dead on historical.
 
Finishing up Queen Charlotte and while i started off enjoying it, by the end I was quite bored by it all. George and Charlotte just seemed so ‘one note’ to me. I was more invested in Lady Danbury’s’ backstory tbh. As always though the casting they get spot on and the costumes/set/hair/make up/music is incredibly well done. Easy background watching but as a story line I thought they stretched things out. But I must admit the end did get me 😭.
The treatments they used on George 3Rd in this - how accurate was that depiction? Looked barbaric!!
 
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Lilykins said:
Finishing up Queen Charlotte and while i started off enjoying it, by the end I was quite bored by it all. George and Charlotte just seemed so ‘one note’ to me. I was more invested in Lady Danbury’s’ backstory tbh. As always though the casting they get spot on and the costumes/set/hair/make up/music is incredibly well done. Easy background watching but as a story line I thought they stretched things out. But I must admit the end did get me 😭.
The treatments they used on George 3Rd in this - how accurate was that depiction? Looked barbaric!!
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I think it's RUMOURED those things were done to him. It was horrific wasn't it :(
 
Gym&Tonic said:
I wasn‘t sure about Queen Charlotte at the start but stuck with it and am so glad that I did because I loved it. One thing I don’t understand though is why we didn’t see an older Reynolds, the Kings Footman? What happened? Did he die? Why was it left unresolved? I feel kind of ripped off by that story arc 😂
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There was apparently a scene filmed with them passing in the hallway as the older version. I presume when Charlotte goes to see George at the end.
But they decided to cut it.
So it looks like he's just not seen because he's with the King
 
I actually watched the first hour or so of that Tudum event on the Netflix YT channel. The Bridgerton presentation was so underwhelming, it was basically Nicola Coughlan screaming against the Brazilian crowd, reading off a season 3 synopsis while those four images were shown in the background. They're really playing this season up as the big one. As I said before, I still have zero interest in either lead and would love to see more of Kate and Anthony. But since those two were sidelined even in what was Anthony's season, I don't expect to see them at all :(
 
UnknownTattler said:
I finally got around to watching Queen Charlotte the other day, and when Lord Smythe-Smith appeared I was like 'is that Lemar??' Yes it is 😁

https://www.hellomagazine.com/film/...ting-major-popstar-in-show-did-you-spot-them/

And the first images from S3:

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you know it’s serious now they’ve got her a new wig!!!

i’ll watch it, but given what we’ve seen of their on-screen chemistry so far i’m not optimistic. forever mad at the casting of the canon “hottest bridgerton brother” colin too: he should be gorgeous (no offence to the actor 🤣)
 
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