Sir Keir Starmer

Status
Thread locked. We start a new thread when they have over 1000 posts, click the blue button to see all threads for this topic and find the latest open thread.
1
It's the bleeping sanctimony though. That's what winds me up personally. That bloody education secretary has a right hard-on for destroying the private education sector. It makes no sense.

This is anecdotal but I once dated a girl who went to a private school (day border), I worked with her dad who was an engineer in a factory (Birdseye-Walls). They scraped and saved to send her there. Under Bridget Phillipson working-class will not be able to afford to allow their kids a better chance. It makes no bleeping sense.

Oh duck, I'm on a rant now. LOL. Ed Milliband and his green-energy bullshit is going to ruin us. I'll try to keep this as simple as I can:

We still have oil reserves in the North Sea.
We have the tech to extract oil reserves with the least possible damage to the environment.
Drilling for oil will give people jobs and wages. Those wages will contribute to tax which the government can use.
The oil can be sold on the world market for profit.
All of this money can be re-invested into 'green' technology.
The people earning money can (if they want) buy electric cars.

How can I come up with this simple tit and Ed Milliband can't?

It's so weird that people are moaning about "scrimping and saving and no longer being able to afford private school fees." It's a luxury good, you don't need to send your kids there and luxury goods are subject to VAT.

It's like me moaning that I was going to buy a Porsche but the vat on it now makes it unaffordable. Boohoo.
 
I reckon Gove is quite a wild one, I think he likes to get on it. In my secret headcanon he’s into really heavy UK drill artists like Sus & Unknown T. Possibly his ringtone is that cheery little 67 anthem “In Skengs We Trust” 🤣🤣🤣
He is actually into rave stuff iirc.
 
I completely disagree with VAT on school fees. My opinion is nothing to do with taxing the wealthy.

School is a free service open to every school-age child, funded by the taxes adults are paying into the system. It costs the government around £5,000 per year per child to provide each school place, considerably more for children with SEN.

If someone opts out of sending their child to state school, regardless of whether that means private schooling or home education, they are saving the government that £5k+ per child each year.

Yet, if those parents opt for private school and therefore pay for the education themselves, they don’t get a tax rebate for the £5k they have saved the government. Plus, anyone affording private schools is likely to be a higher rate tax payer, so is actually financially contributing more to the state school system than many of the parents whose children actually use it.

So where is the logic in charging them EXTRA tax, for opting out of a service? It’s like if an elderly person was entitled to the £300 winter fuel allowance, opted out because they feel they can manage without it, and then the energy supplier charges them an extra £50 on their bill for not having used the allowance.

It simply doesn’t make sense. As a tax, all it is designed to do is target people who want to use their own money to make their own choices.

Another question that doesn’t get asked enough, is why people on middle incomes scrimp and save to put their children through private education? It’s because the state system is a mess, kids who want to learn are subjected to constant behavioural disruption and teachers who can’t discipline, and can’t pace the lessons to each child’s needs. Children are in school 7 hours a day and are lucky if they can achieve 2 hours of actual learning. I have worked in a state secondary school (admin, not teaching), children openly swear in front of adults and it’s not occasion for some kids it’s every other word coming out of their mouths, are allowed to walk the corridors and be out of lessons because they will just argue if they don’t get their own way, ‘additional needs’ are a persistent get-out clause for all kinds of bad behaviour, children who are in the care system can’t be expelled (even when they have brought knives into school). Schools can even discipline because when giving detention for not doing homework or insisting on uniform standards the parents argue back and take the side of their kids and so don’t support attempts to have kids follow rules. The schools are judged so heavily on exam results, and get so little actual teaching when the entire class is paying attention that they repeat themselves in lessons as nauseam, to the aim of simply getting them through the basics of what they know to be within the exam papers. There is zero imagination or explorative extra-curricular in the lesson planning, they are molly-coddling the kids and allowing them to have lots of opinions but not to actually think for themselves.

Some people also opt for private schooling after withdrawing from state school due to their child being bullied and the school not being able to resolve it. Why should those people be taxed in addition to paying school fees when they have only made the switch for their child’s safety?
 
It's the bleeping sanctimony though. That's what winds me up personally. That bloody education secretary has a right hard-on for destroying the private education sector. It makes no sense.

This is anecdotal but I once dated a girl who went to a private school (day border), I worked with her dad who was an engineer in a factory (Birdseye-Walls). They scraped and saved to send her there. Under Bridget Phillipson working-class will not be able to afford to allow their kids a better chance. It makes no bleeping sense.

Oh duck, I'm on a rant now. LOL. Ed Milliband and his green-energy bullshit is going to ruin us. I'll try to keep this as simple as I can:

We still have oil reserves in the North Sea.
We have the tech to extract oil reserves with the least possible damage to the environment.
Drilling for oil will give people jobs and wages. Those wages will contribute to tax which the government can use.
The oil can be sold on the world market for profit.
All of this money can be re-invested into 'green' technology.
The people earning money can (if they want) buy electric cars.

How can I come up with this simple tit and Ed Milliband can't?

Under Bridget Phillipson working-class will not be able to afford to allow their kids a better chance. It makes no bleeping sense.

Education is one of the few remaining ways that working class kids can attain social mobility. God knows the middle classes have sewn up the other traditional avenues (journalism, publishing, media) by educating their midwit offspring beyond their natural capacity and then pulling every last nepotic string to get little Johnny a lovely job at the Guardian or similar.

It's led to two phenomena which economists call the 'overproduction of elites' and the 'crisis of competence'. We see their effects every day, including in this Government. There's so much nepotism on the Labour side of the green benches, it'd make more sense to just pull together a family tree.

Not that it bothers politicians cos they send their kids to private school or they work the housing expenses system to get in catchment area for the few remaining selective state schools. They're all at it. The funniest one was Diane Abbott who has many of her early speeches castigating private schools n then sent her kid to one. And when rightly pulled up on it claimed that it wasn't her fault, it's just that West Indian mums care more about their kids than, presumably, white ones do. TBF, even the Guardian pulled her up for that...the article must've been written by the last remaining working class person in employment there at the time.
 
I completely disagree with VAT on school fees. My opinion is nothing to do with taxing the wealthy.

School is a free service open to every school-age child, funded by the taxes adults are paying into the system. It costs the government around £5,000 per year per child to provide each school place, considerably more for children with SEN.

If someone opts out of sending their child to state school, regardless of whether that means private schooling or home education, they are saving the government that £5k+ per child each year.

Yet, if those parents opt for private school and therefore pay for the education themselves, they don’t get a tax rebate for the £5k they have saved the government. Plus, anyone affording private schools is likely to be a higher rate tax payer, so is actually financially contributing more to the state school system than many of the parents whose children actually use it.

So where is the logic in charging them EXTRA tax, for opting out of a service? It’s like if an elderly person was entitled to the £300 winter fuel allowance, opted out because they feel they can manage without it, and then the energy supplier charges them an extra £50 on their bill for not having used the allowance.

It simply doesn’t make sense. As a tax, all it is designed to do is target people who want to use their own money to make their own choices.

Another question that doesn’t get asked enough, is why people on middle incomes scrimp and save to put their children through private education? It’s because the state system is a mess, kids who want to learn are subjected to constant behavioural disruption and teachers who can’t discipline, and can’t pace the lessons to each child’s needs. Children are in school 7 hours a day and are lucky if they can achieve 2 hours of actual learning. I have worked in a state secondary school (admin, not teaching), children openly swear in front of adults and it’s not occasion for some kids it’s every other word coming out of their mouths, are allowed to walk the corridors and be out of lessons because they will just argue if they don’t get their own way, ‘additional needs’ are a persistent get-out clause for all kinds of bad behaviour, children who are in the care system can’t be expelled (even when they have brought knives into school). Schools can even discipline because when giving detention for not doing homework or insisting on uniform standards the parents argue back and take the side of their kids and so don’t support attempts to have kids follow rules. The schools are judged so heavily on exam results, and get so little actual teaching when the entire class is paying attention that they repeat themselves in lessons as nauseam, to the aim of simply getting them through the basics of what they know to be within the exam papers. There is zero imagination or explorative extra-curricular in the lesson planning, they are molly-coddling the kids and allowing them to have lots of opinions but not to actually think for themselves.

Some people also opt for private schooling after withdrawing from state school due to their child being bullied and the school not being able to resolve it. Why should those people be taxed in addition to paying school fees when they have only made the switch for their child’s safety?
Tbh I’m reluctant to comment here, but surely this is a case for making state schools better. Why are we just accepting this for all our children or just assuming that only the ones whose parents don’t really care about them are subject to state education
 
Tbh I’m reluctant to comment here, but surely this is a case for making state schools better. Why are we just accepting this for all our children or just assuming that only the ones whose parents don’t really care about them are subject to state education
The State system is done for. No one has the will to do what is necessary and remove the multitude of feral kids so that the rest can learn.
 
I completely disagree with VAT on school fees. My opinion is nothing to do with taxing the wealthy.

School is a free service open to every school-age child, funded by the taxes adults are paying into the system. It costs the government around £5,000 per year per child to provide each school place, considerably more for children with SEN.

If someone opts out of sending their child to state school, regardless of whether that means private schooling or home education, they are saving the government that £5k+ per child each year.

Yet, if those parents opt for private school and therefore pay for the education themselves, they don’t get a tax rebate for the £5k they have saved the government. Plus, anyone affording private schools is likely to be a higher rate tax payer, so is actually financially contributing more to the state school system than many of the parents whose children actually use it.

So where is the logic in charging them EXTRA tax, for opting out of a service? It’s like if an elderly person was entitled to the £300 winter fuel allowance, opted out because they feel they can manage without it, and then the energy supplier charges them an extra £50 on their bill for not having used the allowance.

It simply doesn’t make sense. As a tax, all it is designed to do is target people who want to use their own money to make their own choices.

Another question that doesn’t get asked enough, is why people on middle incomes scrimp and save to put their children through private education? It’s because the state system is a mess, kids who want to learn are subjected to constant behavioural disruption and teachers who can’t discipline, and can’t pace the lessons to each child’s needs. Children are in school 7 hours a day and are lucky if they can achieve 2 hours of actual learning. I have worked in a state secondary school (admin, not teaching), children openly swear in front of adults and it’s not occasion for some kids it’s every other word coming out of their mouths, are allowed to walk the corridors and be out of lessons because they will just argue if they don’t get their own way, ‘additional needs’ are a persistent get-out clause for all kinds of bad behaviour, children who are in the care system can’t be expelled (even when they have brought knives into school). Schools can even discipline because when giving detention for not doing homework or insisting on uniform standards the parents argue back and take the side of their kids and so don’t support attempts to have kids follow rules. The schools are judged so heavily on exam results, and get so little actual teaching when the entire class is paying attention that they repeat themselves in lessons as nauseam, to the aim of simply getting them through the basics of what they know to be within the exam papers. There is zero imagination or explorative extra-curricular in the lesson planning, they are molly-coddling the kids and allowing them to have lots of opinions but not to actually think for themselves.

Some people also opt for private schooling after withdrawing from state school due to their child being bullied and the school not being able to resolve it. Why should those people be taxed in addition to paying school fees when they have only made the switch for their child’s safety?
It’s not an added tax, it’s closing a loop hole. They were given VAT status because it’s for charities. What charity work does the private sector do? Some might give some scholarships out to some students but let’s not see them as some sanctimonious safe heaven. The reason why the state sector is in the state you say is because the whole set of social institutions
have been run into the ground so schools are in crisis. Like social services, CHAMS, CYPS. All this money the government can now spend on real stuff rather than having a loop hole that again is exploited by the top earners. They’re going after tax avoiders/evaders next and this is the first step.
 
I completely agree that improving the state school system is the long-term answer, but until that happens, why should the government charge people to opt out of it? If they are are adding a tax premium that reduces people’s options in taking the government or private provision, they should be able to reason that state schools actually provide both an adequate education and decent behavioural standards. Until they can do that, I don’t think they should be forcing more parents to put their children into that broken system

There’s also no VAT if you visit a private dentist instead of an NHS one, you are already paying more per appointment, should you also, as well as paying NI for a healthcare service you aren’t using, pay an additional tax premium for not having used it?

It may have happened with private schools to begin with due to a tax loophole, but the principle of why it shouldn’t be taxed still applies…tax payers have already paid for the state education system, it’s double taxation to then charge them additional tax to opt out of it. It’s not about class or fairness or logic, it’s really just a case of just grabbing money just because the government can, and it’s being proposed by the Labour Government because their party’s voters want anything that is about dragging people who either have money or aspiration backwards. Less children in private schools, is less children with those additional opportunities…instead of dragging people backwards, why not push more people forwards?
 
It’s the absolute epitome of the politics of envy. They don’t want people to aspire to anything. Education, property, business, just tax the duck out of everyone who’s trying to do the right thing (the “broadest shoulders” as he called them) but continue to indulge the lazy, the illegal and the woke. All the time while they have their own trotters up at the table. It’s absolutely disgusting.
 
There we have it, our state schools are for the lazy, illegal and woke and we’re just jealous of the decent folk who send their kids to private schools. I recall it didn’t go down too well when I suggested those criticising Sir Keir for accepting gifts were envious of his ‘big house in a nice area’.

Some of the comments being made about people who attend or send their kids to state schools (and/or vote Labour) are really quite disgusting, but not surprising
 
Last edited:
I’m going to stick my head up here and no doubt get a whole load of abuse.

I am a single self employed mother of one child. I also have a second PAYE job. When my daughter was going through applications for high school she was offered a place at the worst school in the area under special measures. She passed the entrance exam for a very good private grammar school. I decided to pay for her education. She’s a bright but shy child. Had bullying issues in primary school. She’s excelled in private school. I have worked my absolute arse off on my own to pay the fees. We have done without a LOT to do this. I’ve pulled her out for sixth form because I am unable to find the extra money needed with the VAT increase. I have already paid my taxes into the system for a state school place we didn’t use because the school offered is bleeping shite. So come at me with your arguments but it’s people like me - hard working normal parents who will lose out. Bright kids like my daughter who potentially are the future leaders of our country and trying to break out of the shite poor background I grew up with trying to do better in life. Come at me and tell me I’m wrong!
 
Status
Thread locked. We start a new thread when they have over 1000 posts, click the blue button to see all threads for this topic and find the latest open thread.
Back
Top