Made in Chelsea #3

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Dwight said:
The problem with your opinion is that it is genuinely wrong. You are simultaneously describing grooming and predatory behaviour while claiming it isn't those things, that it's just assumptions etc... but any of the suggested age gaps here fall, indefinitely, into predatory. Legality and opinions aside, those age gaps are morally wrong. Idk if there's a personal reason you're taking the stance that you are but it's definitely coming across as argumentative rationalisation... open your mind up to what people are saying here, they're not wrong.

Not to derail: grooming issues aside. I personally think both Ruby and Rez are horrible people tbh. They'll likely end up back together and repeat the whole process again the next time somebody catches one of their eyes again... imo.
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I agree ! She will bounce back to him because she doesn't appear to know any better and he will take her back and no doubt use what has happened with Miles to keep her in line . Definitely something off about their relationship!
 
Dwight said:
The problem with your opinion is that it is genuinely wrong. You are simultaneously describing grooming and predatory behaviour while claiming it isn't those things, that it's just assumptions etc... but any of the suggested age gaps here fall, indefinitely, into predatory. Legality and opinions aside, those age gaps are morally wrong. Idk if there's a personal reason you're taking the stance that you are but it's definitely coming across as argumentative rationalisation... open your mind up to what people are saying here, they're not wrong.

Not to derail: grooming issues aside. I personally think both Ruby and Rez are horrible people tbh. They'll likely end up back together and repeat the whole process again the next time somebody catches one of their eyes again... imo.
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I just can’t work out how you’re all so sure he groomed her? Just because a person is a teenager and their partner is not does not automatically mean the younger party was groomed. This is the definition of grooming, to which there is no evidence of abuse here to me.
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I was 16 when I met my husband and he was 21. He was my brothers friend and I pursued him. We got together when I was 17 and he was 22. He did not in any way groom me! And I find it absolute madness that you can all assume that of someone when there’s no evidence of it. I’m 29 now, he’s 34, we are happily married with 2 children. He has never exploited me, we weren’t even sexually active until I was 18. We have no idea about the start of their relationship. So no I am not wrong.
 
Bagpuss7 said:
I agree ! She will bounce back to him because she doesn't appear to know any better and he will take her back and no doubt use what has happened with Miles to keep her in line . Definitely something off about their relationship!
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That's the cycle...

Hopefully they do actually part for good though.

Doratheexplorer said:
I just can’t work out how you’re all so sure he groomed her? Just because a person is a teenager and their partner is not does not automatically mean the younger party was groomed. This is the definition of grooming, to which there is no evidence of abuse here to me.
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I was 16 when I met my husband and he was 21. He was my brothers friend and I pursued him. We got together when I was 17 and he was 22. He did not in any way groom me! And I find it absolute madness that you can all assume that of someone when there’s no evidence of it. I’m 29 now, he’s 34, we are happily married with 2 children. He has never exploited me, we weren’t even sexually active until I was 18. We have no idea about the start of their relationship. So no I am not wrong.
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I don't really want to get too into it over your actual personal life, your latest comment is inline with what I already replied previously. I'm saying no more on the topic.
 
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Doratheexplorer said:
Well yes it does matter, it’s the difference between legally being rape or not if she was sexually actively with him at 15.

End of the day you can be 16 and be having sex with someone the age of 60. That doesn’t automatically make it grooming just because one person is older than the other. Some will find that disgusting and to others as long as it’s legal it’s up to them.

I’ve voiced that I think it’s unfair to presume he’s a predator or that he groomed her when there is absolutely no proof of that and I would hope channel 4 have more safeguarding in this day and age for them not to be on our tv screens if that was the case. But I’ve said my piece, I’ll leave it alone now.
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Would you be fine thinking your daughter/sister/niece was with a 60 year old man when she was 16?? That wouldn’t make you feel sick at the thought of it? You’re right in saying maybe the older party doesn’t have seedy intentions, but that isn’t the point. The age of consent is there for a reason because if you saw a 15 year old girl with a 59 year old man you would have to assume their intentions are not good. And the difference between a 15 and 16 year old girl is sweet duck all other than the legal age of consent. Their mentality, maturity and bodies do not change that much within the space of a year, yet you’d say it’s absolutely fine??? No. That’s not ok.

The rules aren’t put in place for the instances where there aren’t any bad intentions, they’re in place BECAUSE of the times the intentions weren’t good. It really is that simple.

When I look at Reza and Ruby, their age difference isn’t as extreme but it makes me think what could a 23yo have in common with a 15yo? What could you possibly be talking about/building a connection over? Because when I was 23 talking to a 15yo cousin or whatever was like you were worlds apart.

Not only from the maturity point of view is it weird, but their places in life are completely different. She would have been still in school, probably very little independence at the time while he’s a fully grown adult probably making his own income and a lot more life experience. It does come across as taking advantage and not being horrible but Ruby doesn’t come across as particularly bright in these situations. She seems to just love the attention and wants to be adored, doesn’t seem to mind who from or about the pain that could potentially cause as long as she’s getting the attention. Reza was in a position to take advantage of a naive schoolgirl. That’s exactly what it looks like and of course without knowing all the details I’d love to be wrong.

But everyone knows at that age having an older boyfriend would be deemed as cool and a real ‘goal’. Ruby would have been easy to manipulate and it seemed on the show that when their relationship broke down it was Ruby waking up and smelling the roses and saw what she ‘could have had’ rather than who she ended up being with. I’m no fan of Ruby but anyone with an ounce of cop on would be raising eyebrows at that scenario and could also plainly see that miles wouldn’t be there to pick up the pieces.

Reza has the advantage there of being able to say he’ll never leave her or be avoidant the way miles has been but tbh Reza and Ruby seem like they’ll just make each other more and more miserable as she’ll definitely hurt him more too and he’s toxic for her.
 
Okay I watched the first episode last night, thoughts:

the audacity of Sam to tell Rez to have some self respect 🤣🤣🤣

Tristan and liv drama is.. how can I say? .. BORING also please please PLEASE can we not have another Mimi 😩

Maiva is absolutely hilarious but insane and I never thought I’d say this but I actually really like James 🤣

ruby is annoying as and miles is 100% gay or bisexual, look at how he dresses ..I wouldn’t be surprised if him and julius got together at some point.. Julius is definitely in love with him lol and I don’t think miles will eventually end up with a woman

now..I think this will be an unpopular opinion but… I found the Ollie and Gareth scene quite a hard watch, now I fully support gay people getting married and having kids, I’m kind of on the fence about surrogacy though, but I just found them to come across as extremely entitled ‘I’m ready to be a dad NOW’ I also can’t stand it when men say ‘we’re pregnant’ and in all the articles about it, the woman is no where to be seen or even talked about, I felt absolutely awful for the surrogate who seemed distraught, not only is ivf a stressful process but she will also feel she is letting them down too and especially with it being televised it can’t be easy. maybe I am a bit more sensitive to this because I am having my own fertility issues. And I just can’t help but think that behind closed doors, Ollie and Gareth probably say some misogynistic things 🤷🏼‍♀️ Also the, ‘we don’t shop at Sainsbury’s darling’ eugh

I can’t remember exactly who else is on the show other than who I’ve mentioned so I will leave it there!

Also random but a while ago julius mentioned that him and his brother were one of the first IVF twins to be born in the UK.. that was quite an exaggeration, julius was born in 1993, my sisters are IVF twins and we’re born in 1990 and they weren’t ‘one of the first’, the first in the UK was in 1982 so a whole 11 years before julius was born so I imagine there were quite a few in those 11 years..
 
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Yes to very thing you said! And I totally thought of Mimi too, in fact I was doing something and not looking at the screen when she spoke and I thought it was her for a second! Also very interesting re Julius' IVF claim!

Lonelylondon said:
Okay I watched the first episode last night, thoughts:

the audacity of Sam to tell Rez to have some self respect 🤣🤣🤣

Tristan and liv drama is.. how can I say? .. BORING also please please PLEASE can we not have another Mimi 😩

Maiva is absolutely hilarious but insane and I never thought I’d say this but I actually really like James 🤣

ruby is annoying as and miles is 100% gay or bisexual, look at how he dresses ..I wouldn’t be surprised if him and julius got together at some point.. Julius is definitely in love with him lol and I don’t think miles will eventually end up with a woman

now..I think this will be an unpopular opinion but… I found the Ollie and Gareth scene quite a hard watch, now I fully support gay people getting married and having kids, I’m kind of on the fence about surrogacy though, but I just found them to come across as extremely entitled ‘I’m ready to be a dad NOW’ I also can’t stand it when men say ‘we’re pregnant’ and in all the articles about it, the woman is no where to be seen or even talked about, I felt absolutely awful for the surrogate who seemed distraught, not only is ivf a stressful process but she will also feel she is letting them down too and especially with it being televised it can’t be easy. maybe I am a bit more sensitive to this because I am having my own fertility issues. And I just can’t help but think that behind closed doors, Ollie and Gareth probably say some misogynistic things 🤷🏼‍♀️ Also the, ‘we don’t shop at Sainsbury’s darling’ eugh

I can’t remember exactly who else is on the show other than who I’ve mentioned so I will leave it there!

Also random but a while ago julius mentioned that him and his brother were one of the first IVF twins to be born in the UK.. that was quite an exaggeration, julius was born in 1993, my sisters are IVF twins and we’re born in 1990 and they weren’t ‘one of the first’, the first in the UK was in 1982 so a whole 11 years before julius was born so I imagine there were quite a few in those 11 years..
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Gossipgurlll5 said:
Would you be fine thinking your daughter/sister/niece was with a 60 year old man when she was 16?? That wouldn’t make you feel sick at the thought of it? You’re right in saying maybe the older party doesn’t have seedy intentions, but that isn’t the point. The age of consent is there for a reason because if you saw a 15 year old girl with a 59 year old man you would have to assume their intentions are not good. And the difference between a 15 and 16 year old girl is sweet duck all other than the legal age of consent. Their mentality, maturity and bodies do not change that much within the space of a year, yet you’d say it’s absolutely fine??? No. That’s not ok.

The rules aren’t put in place for the instances where there aren’t any bad intentions, they’re in place BECAUSE of the times the intentions weren’t good. It really is that simple.

When I look at Reza and Ruby, their age difference isn’t as extreme but it makes me think what could a 23yo have in common with a 15yo? What could you possibly be talking about/building a connection over? Because when I was 23 talking to a 15yo cousin or whatever was like you were worlds apart.

Not only from the maturity point of view is it weird, but their places in life are completely different. She would have been still in school, probably very little independence at the time while he’s a fully grown adult probably making his own income and a lot more life experience. It does come across as taking advantage and not being horrible but Ruby doesn’t come across as particularly bright in these situations. She seems to just love the attention and wants to be adored, doesn’t seem to mind who from or about the pain that could potentially cause as long as she’s getting the attention. Reza was in a position to take advantage of a naive schoolgirl. That’s exactly what it looks like and of course without knowing all the details I’d love to be wrong.

But everyone knows at that age having an older boyfriend would be deemed as cool and a real ‘goal’. Ruby would have been easy to manipulate and it seemed on the show that when their relationship broke down it was Ruby waking up and smelling the roses and saw what she ‘could have had’ rather than who she ended up being with. I’m no fan of Ruby but anyone with an ounce of cop on would be raising eyebrows at that scenario and could also plainly see that miles wouldn’t be there to pick up the pieces.

Reza has the advantage there of being able to say he’ll never leave her or be avoidant the way miles has been but tbh Reza and Ruby seem like they’ll just make each other more and more miserable as she’ll definitely hurt him more too and he’s toxic for her.
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I’m entitled to my opinion 🤷🏼‍♀

as long as they’re of legal age, there is no grooming involved (which there is no proof of any abuse or manipulation here apart from an assumption because of the age gap) then it’s none of my business who they want to be with, nor is it anyone else’s business who I chose to be with. They said they had been together 8 years earlier this year which would make her 17 at the time.
 
Lonelylondon said:
Okay I watched the first episode last night, thoughts:

the audacity of Sam to tell Rez to have some self respect 🤣🤣🤣

Tristan and liv drama is.. how can I say? .. BORING also please please PLEASE can we not have another Mimi 😩

Maiva is absolutely hilarious but insane and I never thought I’d say this but I actually really like James 🤣

ruby is annoying as and miles is 100% gay or bisexual, look at how he dresses ..I wouldn’t be surprised if him and julius got together at some point.. Julius is definitely in love with him lol and I don’t think miles will eventually end up with a woman

now..I think this will be an unpopular opinion but… I found the Ollie and Gareth scene quite a hard watch, now I fully support gay people getting married and having kids, I’m kind of on the fence about surrogacy though, but I just found them to come across as extremely entitled ‘I’m ready to be a dad NOW’ I also can’t stand it when men say ‘we’re pregnant’ and in all the articles about it, the woman is no where to be seen or even talked about, I felt absolutely awful for the surrogate who seemed distraught, not only is ivf a stressful process but she will also feel she is letting them down too and especially with it being televised it can’t be easy. maybe I am a bit more sensitive to this because I am having my own fertility issues. And I just can’t help but think that behind closed doors, Ollie and Gareth probably say some misogynistic things 🤷🏼‍♀️ Also the, ‘we don’t shop at Sainsbury’s darling’ eugh

I can’t remember exactly who else is on the show other than who I’ve mentioned so I will leave it there!

Also random but a while ago julius mentioned that him and his brother were one of the first IVF twins to be born in the UK.. that was quite an exaggeration, julius was born in 1993, my sisters are IVF twins and we’re born in 1990 and they weren’t ‘one of the first’, the first in the UK was in 1982 so a whole 11 years before julius was born so I imagine there were quite a few in those 11 years..
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fully agree with the surrogacy thing, i’m also on the fence about the whole concept and felt so bad for her, she sounded so incredibly upset on the phone… no comment on the sainsbury’s line, i liked gareth more when he talked less lol
 
Doratheexplorer said:
I’m entitled to my opinion 🤷🏼‍♀️

as long as they’re of legal age, there is no grooming involved
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Wrong. So bleeping wrong.

I'm sorry I'm really losing patience for this conversation. If you see no problem in your situation then fine, that's your life but what you're saying in this thread is just plain dangerous and extremely counterproductive for progress.

Some of the things you have said are half the problem with young people blaming themselves for ending up in these situations once they start to realise things are not as they should be. (E.g you pursued your partner etc. You well may have but 1. Your older partner should have known better than to return your advances as the adult in the situation & 2. You wouldn't have stated that unprovoked if you thought him pursuing would have been appropriate to begin with) I don't care about your biased and extremely clouded opinion tbh. I care about statistics, I care about research, I care about the facts and the facts are everything we've seen on MIC of Rez and Ruby and everything you have said here is absolute textbook grooming, predatory & toxic behaviour. Whether it's your opinion or not.
 
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mod edit to all members,
post edited to remove any argument, please move on from this, everyone has had their say now.



Ruby wasn’t very kind to Reza and behaved inappropriately for someone in a relationship, he was manipulative towards her? He treated her like tit, held previous issues over her head all the time and as soon as he realised he might lose her and someone else wanted her it’s all ‘I want to marry you, I want to be with you forever, I love you so much’ he never said any of that when the problems started to arise only as a last ditch attempt to keep her where he wanted her. That’s manipulative.

He met her when she was still a child. They started a romantic relationship where an emotional bond was built and she obviously trusted him enough to be with him. There’s no doubt in my mind they slept together back then, and yes it wasn’t illegal but it definitely wasn’t ok. What part of this doesn’t fit the description you shared? In my previous post I stated the huge differences between a 25yo and 17yo if we’re going with those ages, he was in a position of power in comparison to where she was in life. He was a fully grown adult, with money and life experience, she was a girl still in school.

Would you never ask yourself why a 25yo man would be interested in even entertaining a schoolgirl? Would he not find her immature and childish? How would they have anything in common? She’d need fake ID to go for a drink in public with him ffs. What about all that and hearing about how hard bloody maths class is would appeal to a fully grown working adult??

I’m not saying all age gaps are awful, it’s the fact that she was still a child is awful. Maybe you did find a lovely man who had the same age difference and was genuine and never had any bad intentions at all but that isn’t the status quo in this situation for a reason. My parents would be concerned if I were in that situation and I would be too if my child was. Again maybe your situation is the exception but that’s what it would be, an exception, not the norm. You don’t need to defend your personal life that is no one else’s business but just because this situation worked out for you doesn’t mean it’s safe for another girl or woman to do the same thing.
 
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