Coronavirus Disease Outbreak COVID-19 #64

I'm currently feeling..

  • Hopeful

    Votes: 61 16.3%

  • Hopeless

    Votes: 154 41.2%

  • Indifferent

    Votes: 159 42.5%
  • Total voters
    374
  • Poll closed .
Status
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1
Interesting poll results regarding the vaccine.

Screenshot_20201130_213026.jpg
 
malolo said:
But that doesn't mean that conspiracy theorists are right all of a sudden which is where you started your point.
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I said they were right (ish) and although I'm not fully on board with what they say that I do see their point of view.
I work with a woman who lectured me on how we'd all be forced into having it. I argued that they can't do that as any meds when you have capasity have to be given consentually and cannot be given by force as its assault.
I stand by that, that will never happen and they will never get to the point that they make any vaccine mandatory, as we live in a free country where we're allowed choice.
Thing is, if it goes the way its been reported then it is mandatory by proxy, so the conspiracy theorists were right (ish).
Yes we have choice if we go on holiday (I've not had a holiday anywhere in about 10yrs, so it doesn't affect me) but others will be put in that position of having to decide between a vaccine they maybe didn't want, or no holiday. They still have choice granted, but some will feel forced into having it. Same maybe not being allowed in your local pub/restaurant or gym, you can argue they might be luxuries too, but in a way the government could be seen as taking someone's freedom by forcing a choice.
Choice should be free will, unless its against the law. They can't make it law because no one will agree to that and opens up a world of problems with other childhood vaccinations, so we're back to square one in it being mandatory by proxy
 
JustJules said:
Jamhead said:
Likely because the person signing the death certificate knows an awful lot about medicine and health conditions and is qualified to write the cause of death.

It absolutely infuriates me that people actually believe there are drs who would would put false details on a death certificate on purpose.

My friend’s MIL died of dementia....family was told that if they put COVID down as reason for death, they wouldn’t have to wait 9 days for the death certificate, and I’ve heard several other stories where COVID was put down as a reason for death when it wasn’t the primary reason so it does happen!
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I didn't think families had a say on what went on a death cert .
 
JustJules said:
Jamhead said:
Likely because the person signing the death certificate knows an awful lot about medicine and health conditions and is qualified to write the cause of death.

It absolutely infuriates me that people actually believe there are drs who would would put false details on a death certificate on purpose.

My friend’s MIL died of dementia....family was told that if they put COVID down as reason for death, they wouldn’t have to wait 9 days for the death certificate, and I’ve heard several other stories where COVID was put down as a reason for death when it wasn’t the primary reason so it does happen!
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No I’m sorry but it doesn’t. The medical profession is held to a higher standard. I’ve been an ICU charge nurse for well over a decade and I don’t believe this happened for a second.
 
kev1974 said:
I am not sure this will go the way Wee Nippy thinks.
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🙄

I never understand why people feel the need to call Nicola Sturgeon little names like “wee nippy” and “krankie” or whatever.

Yes, people can dislike her, her party, their policies or her general leadership style. That is fine; criticise, be vocal, hold them/her to account. Just leave the wee labels and name calls at the door, eh? It smacks of a bunch of men who fear a female being in charge. 🙄
 
taperjeangirl42 said:
Schools would still be open for vulnerable and key worker children like they were last time. I just don’t like the way they are just pretending schools aren’t a MASSIVE problem here
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In schools it's basically business as usual apart from some hand sanitised and masks in communal areas - though sadly less and less kids are adhering to this and wear them as chin straps..... Schools are dangerous and unsafe. I can't believe I've still not caught covid yet. We've had 200 kids isolating most weeks and 50 staff (secondary)... Feels much safer now as we've got s few year groups off. It's the only way school will function...
 
Cupcakemum said:
I said they were right (ish) and although I'm not fully on board with what they say that I do see their point of view.
I work with a woman who lectured me on how we'd all be forced into having it. I argued that they can't do that as any meds when you have capasity have to be given consentually and cannot be given by force as its assault.
I stand by that, that will never happen and they will never get to the point that they make any vaccine mandatory, as we live in a free country where we're allowed choice.
Thing is, if it goes the way its been reported then it is mandatory by proxy, so the conspiracy theorists were right (ish).
Yes we have choice if we go on holiday (I've not had a holiday anywhere in about 10yrs, so it doesn't affect me) but others will be put in that position of having to decide between a vaccine they maybe didn't want, or no holiday. They still have choice granted, but some will feel forced into having it. Same maybe not being allowed in your local pub/restaurant or gym, you can argue they might be luxuries too, but in a way the government could be seen as taking someone's freedom by forcing a choice.
Choice should be free will, unless its against the law. They can't make it law because no one will agree to that and opens up a world of problems with other childhood vaccinations, so we're back to square one in it being mandatory by proxy
Click to expand...
If it comes down to the travel vaccine then yes that's the government imposing it, but I don't personally see it as being any different to any other necessary travel vaccination.

If private companies (the pubs and gyms you mention) are saying they want you to be vaccinated in order to continue using their services then that's nothing to do with the government.

I'm going to leave it there because we're going round in circles.
 
Platypusfattypus said:
Interesting poll results regarding the vaccine.

View attachment 329943 q
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Really interesting, thanks for posting platy.

I wonder if the lower number of under 35s has more to do with them thinking they don’t need it rather than an apprehension about the vaccine itself?

It’s actually the opposite of what I have found in my friendship group (under 35), we all want it if we can, where as my grandparents are actually the ones saying they won’t have it 😬
 
Platypusfattypus said:
I have to say I've been impressed with the school, my oldest has refused to go in as she's very anxious about catching the virus. They've so far been very supportive and they see she is completing her work. If it carries on it might change but so far so good.
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I'm hoping they'll be understanding especially as I'm still expecting mine to complete online learning during this period.
 
malolo said:
If it comes down to the travel vaccine then yes that's the government imposing it, but I don't personally see it as being any different to any other necessary travel vaccination.

If private companies (the pubs and gyms you mention) are saying they want you to be vaccinated in order to continue using their services then that's nothing to do with the government.

I'm going to leave it there because we're going round in circles.
Click to expand...

Compulsory vaccination is an absolute can of worms

You've got a whole load of people who will object on religious grounds
theconversation.com

Religious concerns over vaccine production methods needn’t be an obstacle to immunisation

Church leaders have raised concerns over a COVID-19 vaccine produced using cells derived from aborted foetuses. But the Vatican has already ruled such vaccines ‘morally separate’ from the abortions.
theconversation.com theconversation.com
Would the government and private companies really throw out the decades of work and laws put in place to overcome and prevent religious discrimination? We've had years and years of being told we have to be inclusive and not discriminate on this that and the other (religion, race, age, sex, sexual preference, disability, poverty etc etc), but all of a sudden the country is going to stomp all over that and it's going to be ok to discriminate on whether someone might have or be able to have covid or not? I can't see it.

Can of worms no. 2, all the people who stay off the books for whatever reason, how will they all be found and given this health passport. Poll tax, ID cards, sharing of NHS records, all been tried before and utterly failed.

Can no. 3, all the people who are here in the UK perfectly legally but ultimately are citizens of other countries. Thousands of American servicemen live in a couple of towns near where I live, here on multi-year placements at air bases that the US Air Force use, how will they be forced to get vaccinated? Or do we just kick them all out?
 
kev1974 said:
Compulsory vaccination is an absolute can of worms

You've got a whole load of people who will object on religious grounds
theconversation.com

Religious concerns over vaccine production methods needn’t be an obstacle to immunisation

Church leaders have raised concerns over a COVID-19 vaccine produced using cells derived from aborted foetuses. But the Vatican has already ruled such vaccines ‘morally separate’ from the abortions.
theconversation.com theconversation.com
Would the government and private companies really throw out the decades of work and laws put in place to overcome and prevent religious discrimination? We've had years and years of being told we have to be inclusive and not discriminate on this that and the other (religion, race, age, sex, sexual preference, disability, poverty etc etc), but all of a sudden the country is going to stomp all over that and it's going to be ok to discriminate on whether someone might have or be able to have covid or not? I can't see it.

Can of worms no. 2, all the people who stay off the books for whatever reason, how will they all be found and given this health passport. Poll tax, ID cards, sharing of NHS records, all been tried before and utterly failed.

Can no. 3, all the people who are here in the UK perfectly legally but ultimately are citizens of other countries. Thousands of American servicemen live in a couple of towns near where I live, here on multi-year placements at air bases that the US Air Force use, how will they be forced to get vaccinated? Or do we just kick them all out?
Click to expand...
I don't see there being a compulsory vaccination for a multitude of reasons.

I just don't agree that it's being made compulsory by proxy either when everything that's being rumoured (and that's all it is right now) is something people have a choice over. I'd question how set against a vaccine you really are if you're willing to cave and get one to go and lie on a beach in Spain (if that becomes a requirement).

Plenty of countries and private business establisments have entry requirements and no one seems to think twice about it, but as soon as it becomes covid related it's all a big conspiracy to some people.
 
SarahGard83 said:
I'm hoping they'll be understanding especially as I'm still expecting mine to complete online learning during this period.
Click to expand...

They should be understanding! Our school has allowed trainee teachers leave placement earlier so they can isolate before going home for xmas. They've also reached out to shielding parents too.

We've had one parent who refused to send her child in from September to November. She would send him in for a day to get school off her back then keep him home as she didn't want him to lose his place. Eventually the school gave her an ultimatum and she pulled him out to home school. I use the term home school very loosely with that parent but 6 and a half weeks off basically and they didnt fine her. Just multiple warnings, couldn't do home visits and ended up with a lot of meetings/phone calls.
 
idk2 said:
They should be understanding! Our school has allowed trainee teachers leave placement earlier so they can isolate before going home for xmas. They've also reached out to shielding parents too.

We've had one parent who refused to send her child in from September to November. She would send him in for a day to get school off her back then keep him home as she didn't want him to lose his place. Eventually the school gave her an ultimatum and she pulled him out to home school. I use the term home school very loosely with that parent but 6 and a half weeks off basically and they didnt fine her. Just multiple warnings, couldn't do home visits and ended up with a lot of meetings/phone calls.
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I just worry as we actually received a letter from the school today about our sons attendance. It's only 86.5% but he's just been diagnosed with psoriatic arthritis so has had a lot of appointments recently. Letter stated an attendance officer may call and that our son may get put on attendance record at school
 
kev1974 said:
Compulsory vaccination is an absolute can of worms

You've got a whole load of people who will object on religious grounds
Click to expand...

So the anti-vaxxers will get religion to get out of getting the Vaccine.

I'm all in for compulsory vaccinations, except for medical exceptions, I know my view will not be popular but how I see it, the more get the vaccine the quicker we get rid of Covid 19.
 
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