Coronavirus Disease Outbreak COVID-19 #57

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hnoz said:
So not exactly no covid deaths then?

You realise how many things are counted as an underlying condition? The vast majority of these are chronic conditions that people live very normal lives with. Underlying health conditions doesn't mean 99 and on deaths door.
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Yeah the “underlying health conditions” thing really naffs me off. High blood pressure is an underlying health condition, obesity is an underlying health condition, these things are so common. Very relevant for COVID but they are hardly only seen in frail elderly “vulnerable” people. I feel like saying “underlying health conditions” is the journalists way of saying “doesn’t matter”. The youngest on that list is 44 - that is no age to die!
 
Whether you agree we should all be “locked up” or not, you can’t get away from the fact that we need to keep within icu capacity. People here have already said in their LAs, hospitals are approaching capacity and if you want a taste for what the next few weeks might look like take a look at what’s happening on the continent.

Beligium are at capacity, they requested some patients to go to the Netherlands but the Netherlands are already sending THEIR patients to Germany!

Can you imagine being so f*cked you have to send your nationals to a different country’s hospital?! Can you imagine if we were carting Carol from Brighton over to Calais to get intubated! It’s madness! And that’s what governments are keeping an eye on most, I think!
 
Find it a bit weird my LA now has 197 cases per hundred thousand but we are still medium (tier 1). Maybe it’s because of the uni or because our hospital is fine, as both our neighbouring LAs are much lower, but I thought 100 per 100k was the limit for moving to high (tier 2).

In which cases we have been over it for weeks now, but life feels pretty normal for me tbh. Not complaining just think it’s strange.
 
July9696 said:
Whether you agree we should all be “locked up” or not, you can’t get away from the fact that we need to keep within icu capacity. People here have already said in their LAs, hospitals are approaching capacity and if you want a taste for what the next few weeks might look like take a look at what’s happening on the continent.

Beligium are at capacity, they requested some patients to go to the Netherlands but the Netherlands are already sending THEIR patients to Germany!

Can you imagine being so f*cked you have to send your nationals to a different country’s hospital?! Can you imagine if we were carting Carol from Brighton over to Calais to get intubated! It’s madness! And that’s what governments are keeping an eye on most, I think!
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To be fair it isn’t quite as dramatic as that, it is more like patients from NI getting sent to the ROI to be treated which does happen even outside COVID times.
But yes, we do need to control hospital admissions.

Hopefully will make most people wake up and realise we have underfunded the nhs for years and our welfare system isn’t fit for purpose. Unfortunately I think that might be wishful thinking.
 
Latest ONS data https://news.sky.com/story/coronavi...es-up-53-on-last-week-ons-data-shows-12115681

hnoz said:
To be fair it isn’t quite as dramatic as that, it is more like patients from NI getting sent to the ROI to be treated which does happen even outside COVID times.
But yes, we do need to control hospital admissions.

Hopefully will make most people wake up and realise we have underfunded the nhs for years and our welfare system isn’t fit for purpose. Unfortunately I think that might be wishful thinking.
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I wonder what will happen after Brexit how will they manage then?

July9696 said:
Whether you agree we should all be “locked up” or not, you can’t get away from the fact that we need to keep within icu capacity. People here have already said in their LAs, hospitals are approaching capacity and if you want a taste for what the next few weeks might look like take a look at what’s happening on the continent.

Beligium are at capacity, they requested some patients to go to the Netherlands but the Netherlands are already sending THEIR patients to Germany!

Can you imagine being so f*cked you have to send your nationals to a different country’s hospital?! Can you imagine if we were carting Carol from Brighton over to Calais to get intubated! It’s madness! And that’s what governments are keeping an eye on most, I think!
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But how much I wonder ? SAGE have been calling for tougher restrictions since Sept and have been ignored ,will the Gov just shrug their shoulders and pass the buck as per when this massive predicted tsunami of patients descend on the healthservice 🤷‍♀️
 
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BasilRathbon said:
Here's an interesting stat for you; Yesterday, in England's hospitals there were no Covid-19 deaths at all!
91 people died in hospitals in England who had tested positive for Covid-19, but all patients had known underlying health conditions and were aged between 44 and 95. If you probe a little deeper and check the daily figures of how many people died of Covid with NO underlying health conditions, the figure is very very small and on most days is less than 10!

Obviously every death is a tragedy for their loved ones but if the majority of people dying with Covid are those who have chronic illnesses that significantly shorten their life expectancy, why is the government continuing to effectively keep fit and healthy people of all ages prisoners in their own homes when the risk is so tiny?
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You’d be surprised at the amount of ‘healthy’ people walking around who have underlying conditions but are unaware.
I.e. High blood pressure
How many people can actually say when they last had that done?


.
 
Everyone stop what you’re doing and look at this. Woolies!
90DA60F7-3FE7-4C41-929F-20ED43B10D96.jpeg
 
I’m 22 and have high blood pressure, it’s common in my family. It’s caused absolutely no other issues for me and I consider myself healthy. However, I’d I was to die from COVID, would I be a “oh well, they had underlying health problems”? I really dislike the train of thought that “only” people with health issues are dying.. those people could be like me and consider themselves fairly healthy.

Bitofthebubbly said:
Everyone stop what you’re doing and look at this. Woolies!View attachment 289525 q
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Just when the year couldn’t get anymore strange!! I did love a woolies when I was younger!!
 
Doc said:
A lot have people have “underlying conditions” that don’t necessarily shorten their life expectancy and they live fit and healthy lives.

I don’t like the undertone of Darwinism/eugenics that goes on in some of these discussions.
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if someone looked at my husbands documented medical history he would get written off.
Stroke. Epilepsy. High blood pressure.
 
sushimama said:
We had several cases like that in my country, the most disturbing one was a girl with appendicitis and no doctor would see her because she didn't have a negative test, she waited three days for one and then got her negative results back on friday afternoon when her GP has already stopped working. In the end it took them 10 days to see her and treat her and by that time her appendix had already burst and they barely saved her.

It is insane and to think this could literally happen to anyone.
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Wow that’s shocking. I was admitted to hospital back in June with suspected appendicitis (while pregnant) 🙈 My test took about 24 hours to come back but I can’t imagine if they’d made me wait so long for any treatment.
 
Doc said:
A lot have people have “underlying conditions” that don’t necessarily shorten their life expectancy and they live fit and healthy lives.

I don’t like the undertone of Darwinism/eugenics that goes on in some of these discussions.
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Well here's a list of what the government defined as "underlying health conditions" at the start of the lockdown. (source https://www.somersetlive.co.uk/news...nderlying-conditions-coronavirus-risk-3959772 )

  • chronic (long-term) respiratory diseases, such as asthma, chronic obstructive pulmonary disease (COPD), emphysema or bronchitis
  • chronic heart disease, such as heart failure
  • chronic kidney disease
  • chronic liver disease, such as hepatitis
  • chronic neurological conditions, such as Parkinson's disease, motor neurone disease, multiple sclerosis, a learning disability or cerebral palsy
  • diabetes
  • problems with your spleen – for example, sickle cell disease or if you have had your spleen removed
  • a weakened immune system as the result of conditions such as HIV and AIDS or medicines such as steroid tablets or chemotherapy
  • being seriously overweight (a BMI of 40 or above)
  • people who have received an organ transplant and remain on ongoing immunosuppression medication
  • people with cancer who are undergoing active chemotherapy or radiotherapy
  • people with cancers of the blood or bone marrow such as leukaemia who are at any stage of treatment
  • people with severe chest conditions such as cystic fibrosis or severe asthma (requiring hospital admissions or courses of steroid tablets)
  • People with severe diseases of body systems, such as severe kidney disease (dialysis)

With the exception of a couple of those I would say all these are conditions which, in themselves, will sadly shorten a person's life expectancy regardless of whether they have Covid at the time of death or not. Therefore it would be wrong to say that these people died of Covid and therefore they shouldn't be included in the daily scary statistics.
 
BasilRathbon said:
Well here's a list of what the government defined as "underlying health conditions" at the start of the lockdown. (source https://www.somersetlive.co.uk/news...nderlying-conditions-coronavirus-risk-3959772 )

  • chronic (long-term) respiratory diseases, such as asthma, chronic obstructive pulmonary disease (COPD), emphysema or bronchitis
  • chronic heart disease, such as heart failure
  • chronic kidney disease
  • chronic liver disease, such as hepatitis
  • chronic neurological conditions, such as Parkinson's disease, motor neurone disease, multiple sclerosis, a learning disability or cerebral palsy
  • diabetes
  • problems with your spleen – for example, sickle cell disease or if you have had your spleen removed
  • a weakened immune system as the result of conditions such as HIV and AIDS or medicines such as steroid tablets or chemotherapy
  • being seriously overweight (a BMI of 40 or above)
  • people who have received an organ transplant and remain on ongoing immunosuppression medication
  • people with cancer who are undergoing active chemotherapy or radiotherapy
  • people with cancers of the blood or bone marrow such as leukaemia who are at any stage of treatment
  • people with severe chest conditions such as cystic fibrosis or severe asthma (requiring hospital admissions or courses of steroid tablets)
  • People with severe diseases of body systems, such as severe kidney disease (dialysis)

With the exception of a couple of those I would say all these are conditions which, in themselves, will sadly shorten a person's life expectancy regardless of whether they have Covid at the time of death or not. Therefore it would be wrong to say that these people died of Covid and therefore they shouldn't be included in the daily scary statistics.
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Sorry but no. They died of Covid because if they didn't catch Covid they would not be dead. Yes by having these conditions it increases your risk of dying from Covid, by most of these people would not now be dead if they didn't have covid. Yes they may have had a shorter life expectancy but they would most likely have been alive now had covid not been around. This is so insensitive to people with these conditions who are living a full (pre covid restrictions) life just as the rest of us are.
 
BasilRathbon said:
Well here's a list of what the government defined as "underlying health conditions" at the start of the lockdown. (source https://www.somersetlive.co.uk/news...nderlying-conditions-coronavirus-risk-3959772 )

  • chronic (long-term) respiratory diseases, such as asthma, chronic obstructive pulmonary disease (COPD), emphysema or bronchitis
  • chronic heart disease, such as heart failure
  • chronic kidney disease
  • chronic liver disease, such as hepatitis
  • chronic neurological conditions, such as Parkinson's disease, motor neurone disease, multiple sclerosis, a learning disability or cerebral palsy
  • diabetes
  • problems with your spleen – for example, sickle cell disease or if you have had your spleen removed
  • a weakened immune system as the result of conditions such as HIV and AIDS or medicines such as steroid tablets or chemotherapy
  • being seriously overweight (a BMI of 40 or above)
  • people who have received an organ transplant and remain on ongoing immunosuppression medication
  • people with cancer who are undergoing active chemotherapy or radiotherapy
  • people with cancers of the blood or bone marrow such as leukaemia who are at any stage of treatment
  • people with severe chest conditions such as cystic fibrosis or severe asthma (requiring hospital admissions or courses of steroid tablets)
  • People with severe diseases of body systems, such as severe kidney disease (dialysis)

With the exception of a couple of those I would say all these are conditions which, in themselves, will sadly shorten a person's life expectancy regardless of whether they have Covid at the time of death or not. Therefore it would be wrong to say that these people died of Covid and therefore they shouldn't be included in the daily scary statistics.
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What an odd comment.
Yes it may shorten someone’s life but contracting Covid may be the difference between dying at 55 or dying at 65. The fact is if it weren’t for having Covid these people may have not died at this time.

That’s like saying oh you’re going to die eventually of your underlying condition so it may as well be now.
 
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