Sir Keir Starmer #2

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Lalla said:
TBH the only pensioners now who are reasonably well off are those homeowners who did well from London/ South East property increases (and even then, that money can only be realised if they sell up and relocate) and/or the ones who had final salary pensions - which is mainly those who worked for big companies or in local govt/ NHS. I would suspect that the numbers who don't have final salary pensions is a lot higher than those who do - and there will be many who only get state pension - and that group are probably also not homeowners.

Affordability of housing is clearly a major issue. When I was growing up in the 1970s, I lived in HA housing. There were a few streets of HA/ council properties in our small town but most people owned their own homes. Whereas my relatives lived on council estates in London and no one owned, everyone rented
Then Right to Buy came in, housing stock reduced, there were less council properties available but also everyone wanted to own their own homes. But what needed to happen and didn't, was that councils used the money to replenish housing stock - instead the number of properties reduced, at the same time as house prices (and therefore rental prices) started to rise.
When Labour came to power in 1997, house prices had already increased a lot but were still affordable. I bought a 3 bed house that year for £75k (the people I bought it from paid £45k 4 years earlier). But instead of investing in social housing, Labour just let prices rise and rise; speculating on property and flipping houses or renting them out became the done thing. And nearly 30 years on we find ourselves in the current situation.
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Then Right to Buy came in, housing stock reduced, there were less council properties available but also everyone wanted to own their own homes. But what needed to happen and didn't, was that councils used the money to replenish housing stock - instead the number of properties reduced, at the same time as house prices (and therefore rental prices) started to rise.

Not only was the council stock greatly reduced, but the ones that were bought up were the decent ones in good areas. Nobody wanted some dump on a shithole estate, so both quantity and quality of housing stock took a nosedive.
 
I rent an ex-council house to a couple who have a joint income of apx £60-70k per year.

During a routine inspection/chat, one of them went on a major rant about how Thatcher sold off the social housing and the Tories being scum etc.

Complete lack of self-awareness…if right to buy hadn’t happened, they would not have the option of renting ex-council (at a rent cheaper rate than most other properties the same size), they would not qualify for social housing, but even if they did, they wouldn’t have the nice owner-occupiers living next door, it would be completely at the mercy of where the council housed their asbos.

I bought my first property aged 19, on a salary of less than £13k a year (2001). I’ve never earned more than £25k a year in my employment and I’ve never lived with a partner so no extra income and never been entitled to claim any benefits. I invested and now have a couple of rental properties because I won’t have a safe retirement if I rely on the government, so having assets seemed the sensible option.

This couple who have more than double my income, and are 10 years older than me…have CHOSEN never to get a mortgage and instead spend their money on eating out and cruises and other frivolities. They could have easily paid off a mortgage (on the type of property they are renting) twice/thrice over in all the years they have been renting.…if they had wanted to. Their mortgage payment would be lower than their monthly rent….I think the issue is that they don’t want to make any sacrifices to save a deposit.

There are young people now who genuinely can’t get on the property ladder due to affordability…but for anyone over 40 who has worked consistently who just decided to rent and not commit to the responsibility of home-ownership…they are part of the problem. Why didn’t they buy as soon as they were eligible for a mortgage, when prices were lower and it was so much easier to get a mortgage? I think the main answer is people not wanting to save for a deposit. I see it repeatedly with tenants…they use all their disposable income and have nothing left.
 
I definitely have little sympathy for people 40 plus who could have afforded to but have chosen not to buy a home, obviously there will be exceptions (those who had a house but had to sell due to not working as a result of ill health or disability, or having to care for a family member, for example).

I do agree that some people are reluctant to save, or unable to do so because they feel they have to have 'nice' things - I blame our consumerist culture for this. And also the impact of planned obsolescence, not being able to repair, replace or fix things that used to last for years (on another thread I was joining in a rant yesterday about loo seats, and how difficult it is to find replacements for certain seats, potentially meaning you'd have to replace the whole toilet. Why are they not generic any more? Whose idea was that?!)
 
Eye_Spy said:
I think the main answer is people not wanting to save for a deposit. I see it repeatedly with tenants…they use all their disposable income and have nothing left.
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I think the main problem is people are brainwashed by corporations and advertising companies to waste their money on the latest piece of plastic/electronic tat. It blows my mind when I see phone adverts ... SAVE 500 POUNDS ON THE <enter a number and a letter> PHONE! Only 25 pounds per month! Are you bleeping kidding me? I'm not saying we should re-introduce morse-code or semaphore, but fucksake. Really?
 
All those people who’ve entered the country illegally will be toasty warm in their hotel accommodations with three square meals a day, priority access to NHS care and £40 spending money per week while the country freezes in sub zero temperatures. Lucky them.
Too bad for the people who pay taxes and can’t afford to put their heating on.
What a tit show this country is.
 
I think the issue is that house price increases are far outstripping wage growth.

Average house prices are set to rise by £84,000 over the next five years. Is my salary going to increase by that much, I doubt it.

Especially if you are a single person it is very hard to get on the housing ladder. The amount I need for a housing deposit with house prices skyrocketing is outpacing how much I am able to save, and with rent and food increases that makes it ever so much harder.

Spending money on a night out or a new jumper really is a drop in the ocean compared to how much you'd need for a deposit on a house.

www.savills.co.uk

Savills UK | Average house prices to increase by 23.4% over the next five years

Savills UK | News
www.savills.co.uk www.savills.co.uk

It really does need to be made easier to buy a house. People can deride and say "don't buy x then" but put plainly, if people are struggling and don't have a reliable income or suitable home they're not going to start families. And we are seeing the effects of an ageing population at the moment where there are fewer taxpayers to pensioners. We don't want the working age population to get any smaller.
 
Theodore said:
All those people who’ve entered the country illegally will be toasty warm in their hotel accommodations with three square meals a day, priority access to NHS care and £40 spending money per week while the country freezes in sub zero temperatures. Lucky them.
Too bad for the people who pay taxes and can’t afford to put their heating on.
What a tit show this country is.
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And who the hell do you think spent the last 14 years making it into one?
 
Miss Begotten said:
You think they are going to make a 14 year clusterfuck better in a couple of months? 🙄
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Tory scum wouldn't have taken away winter fuel money from old people, that's all I know. It's unreal.

I also see that Rachel is going to loosen banking regulations so that certain 'packages' can be sold to people. The banking sector is thrilled as you might imagine. Also the standard of qualifications of those who sell these 'packages' are going to be lowered. My mum got caught out before investing what little savings she had into what she thought was a risk-free investment. Turned-out it was a high-risk investment and she lost the lot. Luckily she isn't a dimwit and went down the bank and tore a bleeping strip off the bank manager. Full refund. Not everyone is like her though.

Labour are for working people? You're having a laugh. They're the same as the last lot of jokers.
 
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We should expect to see indications that they are going to improve things. But so far all the indications are that it’s getting worse. They‘re giving massive pay hikes and tax breaks to doctors, train drivers, tube workers and public sector workers, ridiculously expensive climate policies, billions in aid to other countries, open door policy to illegal immigrants and all the while our own citizens get shafted.
 
TheShire said:
there's wide support for withdrawing it from rich pensioners, labour have taken it from all but the very poorest. Lots of below average and average pensioners will struggle. This isn't the mike drop you think it is.
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Did you read the post I initially quoted? Mentioned nothing about just rich pensioners.
 
I’m retired.
At home all day, except when I am out doing voluntary work at the hospital.
Mortgage paid, some savings. A small work pension so we can cope. Small three bed house, not a mansion.
I have arthritis and an autoimmune condition so feel the cold.
Not just cold, it’s actually painful.
The winter fuel allowance stopped me worrying.
Today I am wearing a thermal vest and woolly jumper. And fingerless mittens.
I have a quilt that I have over my knees.
I am reluctant to put the heating on as it’s only November and I have no idea what it will be like in January and February.
I’m not poor, can’t claim any benefits.
But having paid in all my life I feel let down
 
Are you able to claim attenda
Mollywobbles said:
I’m retired.
At home all day, except when I am out doing voluntary work at the hospital.
Mortgage paid, some savings. A small work pension so we can cope. Small three bed house, not a mansion.
I have arthritis and an autoimmune condition so feel the cold.
Not just cold, it’s actually painful.
The winter fuel allowance stopped me worrying.
Today I am wearing a thermal vest and woolly jumper. And fingerless mittens.
I have a quilt that I have over my knees.
I am reluctant to put the heating on as it’s only November and I have no idea what it will be like in January and February.
I’m not poor, can’t claim any benefits.
But having paid in all my life I feel let down
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Are you able to claim Attendance Allowance?
 
Jane Tee said:
Are you able to claim attenda

Are you able to claim Attendance Allowance?
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No.
I’m just a very ordinary pensioner with an ordinary pensioner husband.
Can’t claim anything.
We aren’t poor. Middle class comfortable I suppose.
That’s what happens when you are sensible, pay your bills, have a bit of saving
But my heating bill scares me.
Really scares me.

I feel let down,
I don’t want benefits.
Jut the protection I paid for all my life
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Mollywobbles said:
No.
I’m just a very ordinary pensioner with an ordinary pensioner husband.
Can’t claim anything.
We aren’t poor. Middle class comfortable I suppose.
That’s what happens when you are sensible, pay your bills, have a bit of saving
But my heating bill scares me.
Really scares me.

I feel let down,
I don’t want benefits.
Jut the protection I paid for all my life
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Just to clarify.
I am fairly active.
I love cooking, so make a lot of soups, stews, etc. Our food bill is ok. We don’t eat ready made meals or takeaways because I make everything from scratch and I enjoy doing that.
I read a lot and use the local library.
We don’t subscribe to any tv channels not because we can’t afford it, but freeview gives us most stuff we need.
We are not struggling.
It’s just that having paid into the system, we feel let down.
 
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Ndrangheta said:
Tory scum wouldn't have taken away winter fuel money from old people, that's all I know. It's unreal.

I also see that Rachel is going to loosen banking regulations so that certain 'packages' can be sold to people. The banking sector is thrilled as you might imagine. Also the standard of qualifications of those who sell these 'packages' are going to be lowered. My mum got caught out before investing what little savings she had into what she thought was a risk-free investment. Turned-out it was a high-risk investment and she lost the lot. Luckily she isn't a dimwit and went down the bank and tore a bleeping strip off the bank manager. Full refund. Not everyone is like her though.

Labour are for working people? You're having a laugh. They're the same as the last lot of jokers.
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Sorry, I am utterly confused with your posts.

On the Politics #9 thread, you were telling us it was 'too early' to judge the Labour Government, and that we should be giving them two years before making judgement.

I'm not having a pop at you personally, as despite disagreements, you are generally not uber nasty towards those you disagree with. Unlike others who can be mentioned on Tattle.

However, I'm just confused at the say one thing on another thread, then join in the criticism on another.

Although I don't disagree with what you've said above.
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TheShire said:
there's wide support for withdrawing it from rich pensioners, labour have taken it from all but the very poorest. Lots of below average and average pensioners will struggle. This isn't the mike drop you think it is.
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Unfortunately there are some on here will defend Labour to the hilt, even if they come out policies thar far exceed the 'nastiness' of the Tories.

Labour could cut off the state pension entirely, yet some would still defend Labour for that.

Partisan politics really does blind some people and warp their moral compass. Except when the opposition does the same, then the war of words is forthcoming.

"Is is OK when our preferred political party implements this policy, but not when the opposition does it."

It really is utter BS by some.
 
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